You’ve probably heard of people talking about decluttering their homes, right? Well, in today’s episode of the Head Trash & Healing Show, we took this concept a bit further and explored not just physical clutter, but emotional and mental clutter too.
Because let’s face it, our internal clutter can sometimes be even more exhausting than the external one!
My guest, Susie, a declutter coach, joined me to talk about how clutter can manifest in different forms and influence our daily lives. And as you may have guessed already, we’re not really talking just about messy cupboards here, but about feelings of being overwhelmed, emotionally out of sync and well, just slightly ‘off’ in general.
We spoke about how laziness, a term often judged harshly, may just be an indicator of unmet needs, and how sometimes, it’s not a sign of stagnation but can actually be a form of self-care. We also delved into the potential pitfalls of using retail therapy as a form of emotional healing – Trust me, it’s an easy pitfall to fall into!
Decluttering – Physical, Emotional & Spiritual
Decluttering isn’t limited just to physical spaces, though. We chatted about the importance of spiritual decluttering, a way of recalibrating our personal values and dismissing what no longer serves us.
I was particularly struck by Susie’s insights on the connection between clothing and our identities and emotions at different stages of life. It was eye-opening how evocative clothes can be – pretty interesting stuff!
Through our riveting discussions, we touched upon various areas such as consumption habits at different life stages, the implications of unresolved decisions associated with storage, and even the emotional implications of releasing the clutter in our lives.
This conversation is packed full of insights and tools that you can employ in your own life. So, whether you’re dealing with physical, mental, or emotional clutter, or are just curious about all things decluttering, I highly suggest you pop your headphones on and give this episode a listen.
As always, if it piques your interest be sure to check out our self-healing community, the Clearance Club that’s designed to offer support and tools on your healing journey.
There is a whole section in the Clearance Club on your home environment and decluttering, which includes themes like messiness and being tidy.
Let’s remember, a clearer space (be it your room or mind) leads to a clearer life – and who doesn’t want that?!
So, tune in, relax and let’s get decluttering together, shall we?
Resources Mentioned During the Episode
Here are the resources mentioned in this delightful episode:
Clearance Club: Our devoted community for anyone looking to kickstart their healing journey for triggers and traumas. A phenomenal resource for those seeking a network of support.
Susie’s Decluttering Programme: An outstanding service offered by our insightful guest, Susie. This programme helps tackle clutter of all sorts – physical, mental, and emotional – over a minimum of three to six months. Ideal for those feeling overwhelmed by their space and unmet needs.
Head Trash Clearance: My signature healing tool created to help individuals overcome fears, emotional wounds, and traumas. It’s valuable for those eager to gain some control and work towards settling their internal struggles.
Susie’s Coaching: A lifeline for anyone ready to pin down unhealthy habits and make conscious choices towards self-improvement. Through coaching, Susie aids us in understanding our stages of consumption and accumulation, and steers us towards a healthier lifestyle.
“Clear Your Head Trash”: My book that provides an in-depth look into the concepts surrounding healing from internal wounds. A brilliant read for those seeking advice on clearing their mental clutter.
Remember, these resources are here to help you find comfort, reduce the clutter, slay those anxieties – whether they be physical, mental or emotional – and step bravely forwards towards a lightened life. So, reach out, get the support you need, and free your mind of clutter today!
About Susie
Susie is in essence a Life Long Declutterer.
She works as a Declutter Coach and uses her warmth and intuition to help people clear clutter: physically, mentally and emotionally by using coaching skills to get to the root of the issue. Instead of just organising the “stuff” you have she personalises her program to understand you and your lifestyle and what is really getting in the way of you having the space you desire. She will help you declutter your life to enable you to achieve what you want in life through having the “SPACE” to do so.
Susie has a background in hospitality and human resources as well as being a mother to three children. She draws on her experiences in life not to “tell” you what to do but to enable her to empathise a variety of life experiences.
You can get in touch here:
https://www.aspaceforliving.co.uk/ – where you can access free downloads, book a free chat and explore working together 1:1
Follow on Instagram: ASpaceForLiving
And join the supportive community on the Facebook Group: A Space for Living
Episode Time Stamps
00:00 Seeking help for decluttering inside and out.
04:43 Letting go to clear head trash clutter.
09:34 Unprocessed emotions can influence our behaviour.
13:25 Keep only what’s worth the hassle.
17:23 Struggling to let go of old identity.
19:44 Coaches help recognise readiness for change, identity.
24:32 Red flags in neglected spaces, especially bedroom.
26:23 Balancing clutter between work and hobbies.
28:32 Questioning whether clutter reflects emotional state.
33:13 Balanced laziness is like using salt sensibly.
36:20 Decluttering from a spiritual perspective and values.
38:29 Let go of habits, embrace spiritual growth.
42:47 Fear and trauma may manifest in belongings.
45:36 Interesting discussion about decluttering and finding more.
Episode Transcript
Alexia Leachman [00:00:05]:
You’re listening to the Head trash healing show with me, Alexia Leachman, author of Clear your Head Trash and developer of head Trash Clearance. A potent healing tool that’s easy to use. Head trash is the home of healing, where you can access self healing tools and resources to help you improve your mental fitness, emotional well being, and accelerate your spiritual growth. This podcast is where I like to share insights, stories and interviews to inspire you on your healing journey. And now for today’s show.
Alexia Leachman [00:00:34]:
Hello and welcome back to the Head trash and healing show. My name is Alexi Leach and thank you so much for joining me today. Now on today’s show, we’re going to be talking all about clutter, mental clutter, physical clutter, all the clutter that is getting in the way of you feeling, I guess, at know how can we feel at peace when we’re surrounded by mess in our homes? But also that mess in our heads is what stops us feeling at peace too. And even though we might think these things are not linked, that they’re not connected in any way, they absolutely are. I remember when I first embarked on my head trash clearance journey, when a very wise person told me this that really stopped me in my tracks and made me think. And the more I’ve done this work, the more I realise how correct they were. And it’s this. It’s when people have a lot of mess on the inside of their head, they cannot handle any mess on the outside, but when they’ve got peace inside, it doesn’t matter what’s going on outside.
Alexia Leachman [00:01:35]:
There can be chaos, there can be mess, there can be disorder, but it doesn’t matter. It doesn’t ruffle their feathers, and that’s because they’ve got peace inside. And so isn’t that an interesting idea? The very idea that maybe the reason that you’re seeking this clean surface, the tidy room, everything in its place, perfection, the Zen environment, that maybe you crave that on the outside, because if it wasn’t like that on the outside, you’d.
Alexia Leachman [00:02:04]:
Probably lose your mind.
Alexia Leachman [00:02:06]:
Because on the inside there’s so much chaos and disorder. So thinking about this clutter that we might have in our homes, in our environments, but also the clutter in our heads, this is why I really wanted to invite somebody to talk about this and how we can really bring these aspects together, the inside and the outside of our environments, to try and understand what the connections are and what the opportunities are for us to improve and to heal and to bring about a shift in the way that we live and the way that we experience life. And so that’s what I’m doing today. I’m chatting to Susie, who is a declutter coach, and we talk all about where this clutter goes from the inside of our heads to the places in our home and what it means and what kind of people she typically works with. Like who seeks out a declutter coach, and what kind of results can we expect from working with somebody like that? And what is really going on when you are wrestling with clutter or struggling with it to a point that maybe it feels overwhelming for you? What’s that a sign of? Why is it that some people have got these incredibly cluttered lives where you go in their house and there’s piles.
Alexia Leachman [00:03:18]:
And piles of stuff everywhere and they.
Alexia Leachman [00:03:21]:
Never seem to be able to get to the bottom of it? Like what’s going on there? This is an episode for you if you want answers to some of those questions.
Alexia Leachman [00:03:29]:
So let’s get on with it.
Alexia Leachman [00:03:30]:
Here’s the time I chatted to Susie all about decluttering.
Alexia Leachman [00:03:37]:
Hello, Susie. Welcome to the podcast. How are you doing?
Susie [00:03:40]:
Hello. Thank you for having me. Yeah, good, thank you. Good.
Alexia Leachman [00:03:43]:
Well, you are a declutter coach and you got in touch because there’s a lot of stuff that we do that’s very similar, and we thought it’d be a really good opportunity to have a chat and really kind of compare notes, maybe more than anything, but also share with people how the overlap between the emotional, what I call head trash, and maybe what some people might think of as clutter, I. E. Potentially in their home. But actually that kind of exists in all the ways as we’ve just been quickly chatting before pressing record. So before we go any further, would you mind just introducing yourself so everyone knows a little bit more about you?
Susie [00:04:19]:
Yeah, absolutely. So, yeah, I’m Susie, a declutter coach. So I work with people quite holistically across physical, mental and emotional clutter. Usually it’s kind of mums or women that feel they’ve kind of lost that sense of purpose and just put pieces back together of themselves by decluttering their home and mind.
Alexia Leachman [00:04:43]:
So this is a very interesting area because this is an area that I work a lot with people in. But obviously I let go, I focus on the head trash, the stuff that’s mainly in the head. But one thing I’ve observed a lot, and I was just sharing with you before we came on, that I’ve got a client that I’m working with at the moment and we’re working on how she’s got to let go of aspects of herself in order to become a mother. And so you just touched on mothers. And so we did a big clearance, a head trash clearance on letting go. And then she ended up telling me, like a week later or two weeks later, she had to cancel a session. She was so busy, caught up in the mission that she’d started, which was clearing out her house. And that wasn’t what we worked on, but it was that sense that she was holding, know, holding on to stuff and not letting go.
Alexia Leachman [00:05:28]:
Once we cleared the resistance, she was able to just freely let go of things that were getting in her way. So talk to me a little bit, Susie, about what are the different ways that you come across the different types of clutter that people have that are cluttering their life and getting in the way of them feeling, I know, liberated and light and a bit more sort of flexible and free to enjoy life.
Susie [00:05:50]:
Yeah. And as you say, it’s so interlinked. And I think that sometimes it’s the physical clutter that people notice more often it’s kind of what’s right in front of them. So, yeah, there’s that aspect. And then mentally, it could be feeling overwhelmed with a to do list as long as your arm and never getting anywhere and feeling pulled in all directions. And then I think emotionally, people come with feeling like something slightly out of alignment. They’re a bit anxious in certain situations, or just feeling like there’s emotion there that can’t come up, or they’re kind of over triggered, I suppose, in different situations. So people tend to come with one of those three presenting symptoms, if you like.
Susie [00:06:36]:
And then as we start the work, it is all kind of interlinked and, as you say, kind of explorations mentally can spark a physical decluttering, splurge or that kind of thing, just as if we’re not feeling ourselves. We might go shopping to kind of retail therapy, that kind of thing. So it’s fascinating how it’s what came first, I suppose, is what I try and get to.
Alexia Leachman [00:07:04]:
Yeah, well, it’s interesting, isn’t it, the retail therapy thing? And I always feel like there’s something fundamentally a bit dicey with going shopping as a form of therapy, because it feels like you’re kind of looking to something that’s not really going to heal what’s going on and that you’re maybe going to add to the problem potentially rather than actually solve the problem. Even though the short term hit does feel quite satisfying. Getting home with the bags and the new outfit, whatever it might be, but actually I sense there’s more going on there. What are your thoughts on that?
Susie [00:07:36]:
Yeah, exactly. And I think sometimes you go through different stages of your life, and this is something I recently listened to on. I think it was a webinar or something, but kind of naught to 20. You’re kind of in that home environment and your bedroom is kind of your only place and your experiences are very linked with your family and schooling. You move from that stage of life to kind of between 20 to 40, and it’s kind of an accumulation stage where we solve problems by buying things and retail therapy is kind of feeding into that, that feel better about yourself by spending some money on something. And then the next stage from kind of 40 onwards is where we try and simplify and cut the bits out that aren’t really serving us. But I think, yeah, retail therapy in that middle stage, it can be dangerous. Like you say, it kind of adds to that problem and it reinforces the need to spend money to solve problems.
Susie [00:08:33]:
So not always the healthiest approach.
Alexia Leachman [00:08:37]:
Yeah. Especially when you need a bigger house to fit the stuff, or now some fancy storage solution to manage all the stuff that you now have. And that can really become quite an expensive habit when you think about upscaling your house, for example.
Susie [00:08:53]:
Yeah. And there’s a kind of topic I like to write or talk on, which I call is the myth of storage. And I equate kind of storage with unresolved decisions, perhaps, or unprocessed traumas that we just want to pack away and either not deal with because we don’t know what to do with it, or it’s too painful, or we don’t want to let go of whatever the thing is that we’re packing away. So, yeah, there’s a lot there as well, I think.
Alexia Leachman [00:09:20]:
So talk to me a little bit more about that because that sounds very interesting how you might maybe look at the stuff that you have in the house, maybe your garage full of stuff, and how that might be representing potentially unresolved trauma. Talk a little bit more about that.
Susie [00:09:34]:
Yeah. So I think when something difficult happens to us and we’re not helped through that at the time, or perhaps it’s too big or you have other responsibilities and you can’t process everything at that moment, obviously for protection, our brains kind of package it away and put it somewhere in our minds that we don’t forget. But it comes through in strange ways sometimes. I guess we all kind of know what that feels like to some extent, but with the kind of link to the clutter and the stuff. I think we do a similar thing when we’re not quite sure what to do with something or it reminds us of a person or a time in our lives that we want to hold on to for good reason, but we kind of don’t need to keep the stuff. There are obviously other kind of strategies and things, but I guess inherently we want to hold on to that memory or that person, or it’s coming from the kind of sustainability aspect and we don’t want to throw things away. We might need it one day, that kind of feeling, but it’s all kind of linked to the similar unprocessing thing or the need we have to process things and work through. So, yeah, that physical representation of the thing that we want to hold onto or the thing that we don’t want to acknowledge, maybe it’s because someone has passed away or it was a childhood memory that you want to hold.
Susie [00:11:09]:
Yeah, it can be difficult to process physical stuff.
Alexia Leachman [00:11:14]:
I remember when I was early on in my head trash clearance journey, when I was the kind of person that would buy, have lots of stock of something, because I had this deep wound of scarcity and running out. So I would always have, like, six tubes of toothpaste just in case I ran out, whatever, like multiple packets of everything. And obviously that took up a lot of space in the cupboards, like bathroom. Things would just fall onto my head as I opened up, shoving it in. And when I started working on this wound, I did a lot of work around just my fear of scarcity. And it was incredible. The week after I did that, we ran out of butter, which is just like, I never ran out. I mean, butter is like an essential.
Alexia Leachman [00:11:56]:
How could you run out of butter? And it’s like, oh, my God, how has this happened? How has this possibly happened? And then I realised, oh, wow, I’ve just kind of healed that part of me that meant, hey, you know what? There’s a convenience store like, 200 metres down the road. This is not a problem. I can just go out and get the butter. But my goodness, for many years, I would have had, like, multiple packs in stock. Now I live in a village and I can’t do that. So now I actually have to stock for practical reasons because we don’t have that facility. Whereas back then I could have just gone and bought whatever I needed, to an extent, very quickly. So, yeah, this idea of scarcity.
Alexia Leachman [00:12:31]:
And you touched on that, this idea of not wanting to throw it away just in case I need it, which is what if I need this thing and then I’ve thrown it and I don’t have it anymore. Well, maybe you could just get another one. So what is it speaking to? Maybe when people are holding on to stuff, maybe there isn’t that emotional attachment going on, but maybe there’s this. And maybe now we can rationalise it with sustainability, because that’s a really nice explanation. Well, I’m not going to throw that because I’m going to upcycle it, I’m going to recycle it, I’m going to sew up that hole in my jeans and put a patch on. Are you really just saying that to yourself? Or where do we draw the line between it being a sustainable choice and it being a sign of clutter, emotional clutter, that we maybe need to kind of confront?
Susie [00:13:25]:
Yeah, there’s a couple of things there. So the first thing is about another one of the kind of strategies I use, I suppose, is the world is your warehouse. So it’s very similar to that when you were explaining about keeping a lot of stock of things, just in case, and that worry that you are going to be in a situation where you don’t have what you need, but what you say about realising that actually, if you’ve got a toothpaste and one more, you know that you can always replenish. So there’s that kind of aspect in terms of the kind of scarcity feeling and that kind of what if I can’t get it? That feeling is what we kind of coach on, because I think that’s the kind of impact that it’s having. And then when you talk about keeping something just in case, or are you ever going to actually get round to it? I suppose a micro process, you really do have to look at the things that you’re keeping one by one, because it can be quite, I guess, overwhelming to deal with it all at once. But something somebody said to me, and I think this is when I was moving house a few years ago, is if you can replace something in 20 minutes or less than $20, just get rid of it. Not for everything, but the things that you are questioning, do I need this? Well, if you can get hold of it in 20 minutes for less than $20, it’s probably not worth keeping if you’re asking yourself those questions. So that can be quite an interesting activity.
Alexia Leachman [00:15:05]:
Yeah. No, that’s a nice easy criteria, isn’t it, to decide whether or not you can get rid of. Like recently I’ve left the UK to move to France, and in the UK there’s very much a culture of, if you order today, you’ll get it tomorrow, you’re very close to things. Whereas now I’m in a situation where there’s no way I’d be able to replace stuff in 20 minutes. I mean, that’s just a dreamland. So suddenly I’ve got, according to that criteria, I’ve got perfectly good reason to never throw anything. That’s not going to help me in that situation. So I guess you do need to be a little bit more.
Alexia Leachman [00:15:41]:
Add a little bit flexibility to that. But the $20 or the 20 pounds or whatever currency you’re in, as long as it’s. Yeah, I can’t think of currencies where it all goes a little bit crazy in terms of numbers. That’s a sensible way to put that so that you can make a decision as to whether or not to get rid of it. Talk to me about clothes, because clothes seem to be an area that I think has got quite a lot of emotional stuff tied into it. I don’t want to sort of lead this. You take the reins here. Talk to me about chosen.
Alexia Leachman [00:16:15]:
Get a ridiculous. And you work a lot with women. So I imagine that this is huge. Like, I will get back in those genes. Honest. What does it say about how they feel about their own shape or where they are in life? Talk to me about clothes.
Susie [00:16:28]:
Yeah, and I think you’re right. There is that emotional side. And clothes are really quite key to our identities. And I think especially as women, we go through different kind of phases of our life when perhaps before a relationship, before a marriage, before we have children and kind of also with the whole Covid situation. I think we were at home for months on end and clothes took a different kind of role. We were looking more for comfort, perhaps, or just practicalities of things. But I think it’s that kind of identity that exists with our clothes and the stages of our lives that really tie certain pieces into our emotions. And there’s a whole thing about if clothes don’t fit and you have to move to a new size and then you’ve got all the clothes from before.
Susie [00:17:23]:
And yeah, I think it can be really difficult because we don’t want to let go of that wonderful time when we were slimmer perhaps, or even if we were bigger at that stage, whatever it is that what that represents to us in terms of our identity. So it is difficult. And I always say, don’t throw anything away that you’re not ready to because sometimes it’s that wrench that then creates a new kind of trauma or a new problem for people. But I think asking yourself, what is it costing you by holding on to all of these things? And with clothes, perhaps it’s about. It’s costing you. Well, obviously the practical side, like wardrobe space and space in general, and perhaps something deeper in terms of, well, I’m holding on to that identity. And actually, is that really serving me or is it holding me back from creating a new identity that I want to kind of step into? It is a big thing.
Alexia Leachman [00:18:38]:
Yeah. And it feels like when I became a mother, I held on some clothes because I really wanted to get back to pre baby life. I think, and I think for a long time I was not denying that I was a mother because that sounds like child neglect, so I wasn’t that far. But it was very much like resisting the mother in me and still thinking that I was this person that had freedom and I could just do what I wanted. And it’s like, no, no, you can’t. And I think I arrived into motherhood kind of screeching with my feet ahead, like, no, I don’t know if I can handle. I want to be where I was before this responsibility, maybe. I think a lot of that was tied into the clothes that I had and me then getting rid of them was a definite part on my part going, okay, I am saying goodbye to this part and that’s a really tough ask, actually, to kind of admit to saying goodbye to a chapter of your life.
Alexia Leachman [00:19:40]:
How do you help people over that hump? Because that feels like a big one.
Susie [00:19:44]:
Yeah. And it’s a lot. Obviously, the non judgement that we bring as coaches and the kind of safe environment and I guess it is helping the person recognise when and where they feel ready to kind of move on. And it is always a little bit different for everyone. As you describe it was that kind of the change of identity to being a mother and all of the things that that past life kind of represented in terms of freedom, but also it’s about how do you bring those values and needs into your current identity and realising that you have a choice of who you are and who you are, that shows up as that new identity. So, yeah, there’s definitely themes about moving on, moving into a new kind of being, but also recognising what you don’t want to leave behind, because you may choose to leave behind the clothes and the physical, but I want to bring that healthiness that I had, I want to bring that sense of freedom and all the kind of the things that. Yeah, that you don’t want to leave behind. And how can you make that in your new way of being, but just never going too fast for people emotionally takes a bit longer to catch up.
Alexia Leachman [00:21:11]:
Yeah. And I’m just wondering whether in the work that you do, whether you find that this decluttering or the holding on, whether it could be stuff, but whether or not that also shows up as weight on the body, is that something that you come across?
Susie [00:21:25]:
Yeah, absolutely. So I think it does manifest in so many different ways, and weight and health and mental health, as well as physical health and aches and pains. And I also see it showing up a lot in kind of anxiety and depression, because it’s like your body knows something’s not quite right, so it’s kind of trying to send you these messages. And when things are out of alignment, whether it’s a relationship that needs to be decluttered or a physical environment, or you’re just not meeting your values as much as you could be doing. Yeah. It shows up in physical and mental and in every way, including, as you say, kind of weight and body.
Alexia Leachman [00:22:10]:
Yeah. So what kind of process? I mean, you’ve touched on a lot of things like the alignment of your values, living in accordance to your values, showing where you’re maybe not expressing your values, maybe authentically, whether there may be things that you have in your life that are not aligned, whether that’s the relationship. So what might be some of the key steps that you might sort of walk people through to help them to kind of work through this? Maybe a little bit faster than they might if they were just left to their own devices.
Susie [00:22:42]:
Yeah, exactly. It’s about changing their perceptions, I suppose, and perspectives on things and really working out what they want. So we do quite a lot of visioning about the future and then kind of getting under the skin of why that’s not possible now. So lots of limiting beliefs that might be getting in the way that people don’t necessarily recognise because it’s just how they see the world. So we try and shift that kind of view of the world, if you like. Obviously, a lot of values work, we do some practical stuff as well. So you may have heard of the wheel of life, so you kind of look at different aspects of your life. We also do it for home.
Susie [00:23:26]:
So different rooms or categories and how good or not people are feeling about certain categories was a little bit of NLP, a bit of that, a bit of transactional analysis to kind of work out where you are in terms of relationships and taking control, if you like. What you can and can’t control is a big thing, but, yeah, lots of things up my sleeve. It’s kind of less prescriptive in terms of what I might pull out the bag, but more I kind of chart the journey, if you like, for the person.
Alexia Leachman [00:24:04]:
And in terms of people’s houses, I mean, that must be super interesting. And I’m quite nosy. So the idea of going in and kind of having a peek about, are there any kind of rooms that really symbolise the epitome of their challenge? I don’t know. Maybe it’s mainly in the bedroom, in the clothes, or maybe it’s the kitchen, maybe it’s the garage. Is there sort of certain spaces where you really see this on full display or is it just different for everybody?
Susie [00:24:32]:
I mean, it is different, but there are some kind of key red flags, if you like. Okay, definitely a full up garage or loft I see as that really long standing, I don’t want to say issues. It feels a bit judgmental, but long standing things that haven’t been dealt with, perhaps you build up. Yeah, those kind of put away areas. Bedroom is more. I’ve seen more in the female clients that I’ve had because that is really where I think we as women, that’s our kind of sanctuary type place. We keep our makeup, if you use makeup and clothes and all of the things that we use to prepare ourselves for the world, if you see what I mean. So often kind of bedside tables, tops of drawers, things like that can get quite cluttered.
Susie [00:25:28]:
And then day to day spaces. So often it is about the side boards or the tables or any where there’s a stair surface that often gets quite cluttered. But in terms of, that’s more of an amber flag, if you like, because that’s more of a day to day, in the moment kind of clutter rather than a deep seated. And it’s less about you, it’s less effective onto your identity as a bedroom would be much more kind of emotional side of things. So, yeah, they kind of different areas of the home represent to me anyway, and where I might see things showing up for people.
Alexia Leachman [00:26:12]:
So what about guys? Have they got any red flag areas that are kind of. Are they also with the bedroom and the clothes? Or do they find that they’ve got different kind different red flags going on for them?
Susie [00:26:23]:
I mean, it’s definitely a different kind of clutter, I would say. I think that tends to be more in the moment stuff as garage and loft, obviously, as we are humans. I mean, a lot of guys find their office spaces get quite cluttered if they work at home. And it’s about balancing that work and home, which I think as females, we’ve kind of been doing for longer, having to juggle more around childcare and things like that. But yeah, and I think men, it can often be linked to a hobby is how it shows up. And that’s what’s their kind of presenting thing, is that they have this hobby or interest that perhaps their partner is not quite on board with all the stuff. But again, that’s kind of their identity and perhaps childhood things that they don’t want to. It all comes back to similar roots, I think, but maybe looks different on the surface.
Alexia Leachman [00:27:18]:
Yeah. And if somebody was sort of looking at, they’ve just heard you describe some red flags, they’re like, oh, my God, my garage is rammed. And whatever, they go, yeah, okay, I’ve got a situation here. What kind of time frame can they expect to kind of get to the root of this? And I know that you’re going to say it depends, but if somebody was really committed, they’re like, I’ve really got to sort this out and I’m going to go all in. What could they expect to be able to kind of get to the root of some of this for them.
Susie [00:27:53]:
My programme is a minimum of three months. So during that time, you would go through the full kind of steps of the journey of trying to work out the root of the cause and what you might like to have. Instead, we also kick start the physical side, which again, depends on how much stuff they have. But in terms of actually really getting that motivation, getting the energy, getting the understanding, deciding what they want it to be instead, it can be done in, I would probably say the three months, some stretch it to six because they’ve obviously got other bits going on in life.
Alexia Leachman [00:28:32]:
Yeah. Okay. So that’s fairly, I guess, a positive that’s changing. Bring around quickly. Now, I’m just wondering, we’re kind of assuming that it means you’ve got these decluttering challenges. Let’s say generally if you’ve got a house that’s full of stuff, but do you come across this need to declutter and where it might be more on the emotional, like, let’s say I’m talking about to do lists or overwhelm with tasks where your head is completely overrun, but maybe they live in a bit of a zen environment or a bit of a minimalist. Does it always show up in the environment? Or do you find that sometimes people that maybe they make allowances they need to have it completely neat and tidy around them because the inside of their head is just so cluttered that if it was cluttered on the outside and the inside, they probably would just start glitching and not functioning. Do you ever see anything like that, or is it always backed up by clutter in the environment?
Susie [00:29:32]:
In my experience, there’s always the physical clutter element, but it may not all be out. They might live in a very, like you say, Zen and minimalist environment, but they may have hired a storage unit, or they may have the stuff in the loft or stuff still at their parents or that kind of thing. But, yeah, I haven’t come across it yet where it’s not reflected at all. It may just be a messy desk, it may not be to the extent of, say, a hoarder kind of experience, but there may be something going on as well.
Alexia Leachman [00:30:13]:
Yeah. Where you open the cupboard and it all just falls on your face. As long as I can’t see it, I don’t have to think about it.
Susie [00:30:20]:
Exactly.
Alexia Leachman [00:30:21]:
That kind of thing. Yeah. I’m just wondering whether there’s so many memes that you see are going around on social media about, oh, well, if you’ve got a really unmassy desk in your clutter, it means you’re super intelligent and actually it’s not a problem at all. Do you buy into that, or is that just a meme?
Susie [00:30:38]:
I mean, that one’s just a meme. I do think that a clear space helps you untangle, I guess, in your words, the head trash. It does enable that to come out. But I think there’s also a side of the madness of genius, and not to judge your ability and intelligence on your space. Just like I don’t believe in laziness, I always think there’s something else. Maybe it’s just motivation, but I wouldn’t call it laziness. So some of the memes, yeah, they ring true, don’t they? But some, I would think, are just not fair. Not fair on people.
Alexia Leachman [00:31:23]:
I’m intrigued by your comment that you don’t believe in laziness. Just explain that a little bit more to me, because I’m curious as to what you mean.
Susie [00:31:32]:
Yeah. So I think people blame themselves quite often if they haven’t got something done or they don’t want to do it, and they will just say, oh, I’m just too lazy. But I always think underneath the perceived laziness, there’s a need there. And is it a need for rest? Is it a need for compassion? Is it a need for help. Or maybe they just plain don’t want to do it and can’t summon up that motivation. Or it could be disability, it could be neurodiversity, it could be something else going on. I think there’s always a reason to give yourself grace. Yeah, be kind and really understand yourself.
Susie [00:32:17]:
More to know why? Because I don’t think there’s any kind of morality in housework or working hard for no reason. Perhaps it’s not a moral issue, it’s something else. I think laziness kind of implies there’s a morality there.
Alexia Leachman [00:32:37]:
Yeah, well, it kind of comes with judgement, doesn’t it? Because we kind of think of lazy as being bad, whereas lazy could actually be a good. Like, well, I think of myself as being lazy, but in terms of it means I don’t want to waste time doing things that are unnecessary. So I’m always going to find the shortcut. So if I can find a quick way to do it, because actually I’m inherently lazy, I don’t want to take the long way. So I’m always looking for shortcuts. And I think that’s a good thing to be lazy. I’ve persuaded myself at least that that’s actually a good thing to be lazy in that way. And I choose to be lazy about certain things.
Alexia Leachman [00:33:13]:
So I’m mindful with my laziness. For me, I don’t think of laziness as being a bad thing or it’s not a good thing either, but it’s something that you can use in balance, just like you use salt sensibly. You don’t go crazy with it, you don’t put too much, but you need some of it. So I think a minimum amount of laziness is actually quite important because maybe isn’t that to do with self care what you just talked about, the compassion, not overloading yourself with too many things to do, and getting overwhelmed and exhausted and burnout and blah, blah, blah. So, yeah, I was just interested in the laziness because I think there’s a whole other whole. Sometimes when confronted with your clutter, you feel this inherent kind of like heaviness. And I just don’t want to sort it because it just feels like too much hard work and I just don’t have the energy to wade through that. But maybe I don’t have the emotional energy to tackle that task right now because it feels like it’s going to call up too much of me and maybe I’m going to have to confront a few hard truths I’m not quite ready to confront yet, so I’m just going to put that over there.
Susie [00:34:21]:
Yeah. Maybe it’s reframing laziness that actually don’t use laziness as a stick to beat yourself with. And if you want to use the word as a way to describe that compassion and taking a rest when you need to and finding the quickest way. Totally common sense, isn’t it? Like, why waste energy then? That’s all right, isn’t it? Just don’t use it as a stick to beat yourself with.
Alexia Leachman [00:34:47]:
Yeah. So in terms of, we’ve talked about emotional decluttering. We’ve talked about physical decluttering. Is spiritual decluttering a thing or is that not a thing? Does that feature on your landscape at all?
Susie [00:35:05]:
So I suppose my relationship with spirituality is that it kind of shows up for me in terms of values, I think.
Alexia Leachman [00:35:14]:
Okay.
Susie [00:35:14]:
I don’t see it necessarily as a separate thing to declutter. And do you mean all of the stuff that’s out there? How do you wade through what’s right and wrong?
Alexia Leachman [00:35:27]:
Well, I guess, yes, I guess there’s an element of people, when I think about spirituality. For me, spirituality is about really connecting to a better version of yourself. And so some kind of bring in ideas of God and religion or speaking to their guides or that part of it. And that might be part of what spirituality means to some people. But I guess spirituality for me is about constantly improving myself to where I was yesterday. And maybe that means I’m going to start having faith and tapping into faith. And maybe it means I’m going to start having some spiritual gifts, but that doesn’t necessarily define the spiritual experience for me. But I guess when we think about personal development, there’s our spiritual being, there’s our physical being, there’s our emotional self, there’s these different facets of ourselves that exist.
Alexia Leachman [00:36:20]:
And so I’m just curious as to what decluttering might look like from a spiritual perspective, if at all, that is a thing. I guess when I would think about it, if you mentioned it’s maybe to do with your values, so honing in on the way that I maybe look at it, which is being a better version of yourself, maybe your values do shift, especially maybe when you become a parent, where you go, hang on a minute, I need to maybe declutter actually being free and having that liberation that I had as a single person. That might be great then, but actually it doesn’t fit my life anymore. The need to go and sort of go travelling with a backpack, maybe kids isn’t going to kind of work in the same way. So maybe I need to just let that value go or tone it down. And so maybe there’s a bit of recalibration going on with your value set in terms of recognising. This is what’s really important to me now that was, and I’m just going to dial that one down doesn’t mean I don’t find it important. And I’m now going to consciously dial this one up or adopt this one because maybe now the sustainable piece is now landing on people’s desks a bit more and they’re like, okay, this is going to be more meaningful to me.
Alexia Leachman [00:37:30]:
So I’m just wondering what your thoughts on that angle with it all.
Susie [00:37:35]:
Yeah, and I think it’s quite an overarching concept in many ways. So like I said about the values and letting go of what’s not serving you, whether that’s spirituality aspects or things that you’re doing that you maybe don’t always question because you’ve always done them or you’ve always thought them. So I hadn’t considered it kind of separately. And I think when we work through the wheel of life together, I think if it’s something somebody wants to bring, then it often shows up on there and I guess we work with it as we work with other things. So what’s working, what’s not working and how they would see that being improved and then allow the person to kind of talk about what’s going well and what’s not really.
Alexia Leachman [00:38:29]:
Yeah, and then letting go of habits. Because I know that with some of the spiritual teachers or people that are kind of very prolific and vocal on spiritual topics will be talking about things like, well, you need to sort of be kinder to your body. You got to stop doing caffeine and maybe doing like letting go of habits that are really holding you back from maybe becoming the human being that you want to be. And so there’s potentially a lot of decluttering of habits going on there that some people might becoming a vegetarian or vegan or stopping with the coffee and the dairy, whatever it might be. That that’s another way of letting go of things. That will also mean you’ll be letting go of toxins or things that may be keeping your vibration low or whatever it is, but could also feel that will be cluttering your life because these habits, like got to have the coffee by 10:00 a.m. Because otherwise I’m going to get my headache got to have those that smoke need to go and get my fag break. These are these habits that fill your day, that take up time, that take up energy, that take up money, that will be slowing you down and maybe aren’t aligned with your values.
Alexia Leachman [00:39:35]:
So I suspect there’s a lot of habit dropping conversations going on with your work. Is that fair to say?
Susie [00:39:42]:
Yes, it is, yeah. We have a whole session on habits, and like you say, it’s about what are the ones that are serving you, what’s not serving you. And then I am a coach, but often it’s not pure coaching. There’s a lot of kind of strategy and things to implement. But yeah, as you say, it’s a real big thing. There’s a lot of thought around habits out there at the moment. Things about 1% changing every day will lead you further on. And you are the things that you do and all of those kind of things, and it’s actually harnessing the control that people have because obviously there is minimal control over things other than yourself and where you can control things.
Susie [00:40:33]:
Let’s decide. Let’s be trying to think what the word is beginning with c that I’m trying to think of, but consistency, isn’t it?
Alexia Leachman [00:40:41]:
Oh, yeah.
Susie [00:40:42]:
Be consistent and conscious about what we choose to do. You might just naturally, mindlessly scroll in the evening on your phone or just watch rubbish on tv, but actually, maybe that’s for a need for rest. But can you meet your need for rest in a nicer, more healthy, productive, better kind of way for yourself?
Alexia Leachman [00:41:07]:
So it does feel like a little bit of a life overhaul, actually. And I’m just wondering with the going back to traumas, because I do love talking about traumas, whether there are any. The thing with traumas is we often don’t know what kind of traumas we’ve got that we need to let go of or process or resolve. We’re quite blind in many respects when it comes to traumas. I’m just wondering, with the work that you’ve done, whether there are any signs of certain types of traumas where you go, oh, if I see this going on, it’s usually this kind of thing, or if I see that, then I know to kind of ask questions around this area because it’s usually to do with that. Do you come across anything like that where you see the signs of a certain type of trauma that is quite indicative, which gives you the insight to be able to probe in a certain area and uncover something for somebody?
Susie [00:41:56]:
Yeah. And it’s often not the actual event of the trauma, but it’s the impact on what’s kind of left behind. So a lot of people will say, oh, I just want my home to be nice, so if people drop round, I can just invite them in and feel comfortable. And, yes, although on a practical level, you understand that if your house looks nicer, you’re going to feel more hospitable. Perhaps. But I think there’s a lot there in terms of that shame feeling and the worry of being yourself, when maybe you’d rather be in control of what people see of you. So that could be around trauma to the person rather than witnessing something. But it’s all of the feelings that are kind of left that we don’t necessarily.
Susie [00:42:47]:
Like you say, we don’t know that they’re there, but they show up in kind of different ways. So often if people say, oh, I just don’t want to have people around, or there’s something about shame, perhaps, or exposing themselves, like you talked about scarcity earlier. So I think sometimes when people surround themselves with stuff, it’s often a fear of being. Perhaps being in poverty or not being able to get what they need from a certain situation. So whether that is about love or stuff, it could be either trying to think of other kind of. I think if there’s a clothes thing going on, that could be about the identity. So that could be a trauma to do with changing your identity. So losing a job or even having a child is often positive, mostly, but there could be trauma around the changes or breakdown of a relationship.
Susie [00:43:49]:
Yeah, endless traumas, really, as humans, there are.
Alexia Leachman [00:43:53]:
And do you find that when you’re working with people and you maybe uncover that, do they go, oh, yeah, no, actually, you’re right and they’re totally there, or are they sometimes, oh, my goodness, I never even realised that that was a trauma. Do you get maybe both of those responses? What do you typically get when you kind of start hunting down the trauma route with people?
Susie [00:44:17]:
It is a bit of both. And I do think there’s often quite a lot of emotional release at the moment that they kind of realise what it’s left them with, whether that’s a limiting belief that they don’t deserve something, whether it’s a feeling of never being good enough or the shame of things that have happened. But I do think sometimes it can be even harder when they don’t quite want to acknowledge or can’t quite acknowledge that actually there’s something deeper. So they might feel quite defensive, or they might come across as, no, I’m absolutely fine. Living in my hoarding mess or whatever it is that’s going on. And they think they just want help to move stuff on or get a skip or whatever it might be. They don’t know. And that can be quite hard to really sensitively break down some of those walls.
Susie [00:45:16]:
So we do quite a lot of work around feelings, emotions, and maybe it’s about connecting in with where it sits in your body and taking that step back to kind of let’s see what feelings are going on and that can be a way in as well, to help people.
Alexia Leachman [00:45:36]:
Well, brilliant. Lots of food for thought there. Well, thank you so much, Susie, for sharing all of this today. I think there’s going to be lots of food for thought that those that maybe spot a bedside table that’s got clutter or desks. And I’m just thinking, I hope my table behind me doesn’t look too cluttered for this chat we’ve had today. Where can people find you if they want to find out more about your work and your three month programme for decluttering their lives?
Susie [00:46:02]:
Yeah, and thanks for having me. It’s been great to talk to you. So I have a website which is a spaceforliving co. Uk. I’m on Instagram and Facebook, also a space for living. And yeah, I also have a Facebook group. So if people want to join, a really lovely, supportive environment to kind of just get tips know, maybe not ready to jump into a programme, but just want to see what might help. Yeah.
Susie [00:46:31]:
Day to day, then. That’s a lovely place.
Alexia Leachman [00:46:33]:
Okay, well, I’ll have all the links in the show notes for this episode and below the video if you’re watching on YouTube. So thank you, Susie, for joining me today. It’s been fabulous.
Susie [00:46:44]:
Thank you for having me.
Alexia Leachman [00:46:46]:
Wonderful. Let me just start recording. You’ve just been listening to me, Alexia, here on the headtrust show. If you’d like to join me on your self healing journey, then let me invite you to join my clearance club. This is my self healing community and membership, where I provide you with everything.
Alexia Leachman [00:47:05]:
You need to clear your head, trash.
Alexia Leachman [00:47:06]:
And heal your wounds. And every month we come together for.
Alexia Leachman [00:47:09]:
Support on the group call to find out more.
Alexia Leachman [00:47:12]:
Head over to clearyourheadtrash.com club. Until next time, bye for now.
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